FBI tape shows Kohring with hand out

No one in the room knew it, but the conversation was being recorded by a secret FBI camera.

What happened over the next 20 minutes became, in some ways, the centerpiece of the federal corruption case against Kohring, which has been playing out in a federal courtroom in Anchorage over the past two weeks. Kohring was convicted Thursday on three of four charges.

Prosecutors played more than 30 videos and wiretaps during the trial, and jurors heard extensive testimony from Allen, Smith and others.

But this was the one recording that showed Kohring accepting cash from Allen.

Does the recording prove Kohring solicited and took bribes? Did he promise or things in return? Prosectors say yes. Kohring and his lawyer say no.

We're printing a full transcript of the recording here. Watch the video for yourself, and see and hear all the audio and video evidence in the case, at adn.com/fbi.

The transcript was created by the Daily News. It has not been edited for profanity.

The scene: Suite 604 of the Baranof Hotel in Juneau. In the room, then-Rep. Vic Kohring of Wasilla and two executives of the Veco Corp.: CEO Bill Allen and Rick Smith, the company's vice president for government affairs. They are all seated.

Kohring: ... I've got a situation where, ah, it's a personal financial matter, that I think potentially could hurt me politically. When I had my surgery three years ago, I got in a real hole, financially, and I put a bunch of it on credit cards. And I managed to pay off a couple of those credit cards, but I have one big one where I've got a $17,000 debt and it's potentially a court situation 'cause I got overwhelmed with it, and I just couldn't make the payments and I'm now in a situation where it's gone to collections, not to court or anything, and I'm worried if it goes to that point it could hurt me politically. There'll be a public record and I don't want there to be any evidence of any public issue going on. So, what I wanted to do was ask you guys for your recommendations as to how I can deal with this. And I wanted to suggest a couple of things, with all due respect, and please don't feel like I'm applying any pressure, I've come to you guys because you're friends. And I was wondering if there would be a possibility of perhaps doing some kind of a project to make some money with you guys or you could refer me to somebody that could help me with that or as another option maybe you could help me with some financing like a modest loan or something so I could get this paid off and have it behind me and get it paid off to you folks or to whoever you can help me with.

Smith: So you say a couple, two thousand in credit cards?

Kohring: I've got one credit card with Bank of America that is way past due; I just can't keep up, I just don't have the money for it. And I've been trying to sell my Wasilla house to pay, and it was listed for a year and I wasn't able to sell it.

Allen: How big is your payment?

Kohring: Well, actually, it's to a point now where they're demanding full payment on the full 17 grand. I was paying 500 bucks a month on it for the last half-dozen months, and they wouldn't accept that anymore. They were demanding full payment, so they sent it to a collection agency. And I'm in a situation where the collection agency is demanding full payment and I don't have the financial wherewithal or the credit, to be honest with you, to go into a bank and get a loan to pay this off. My credit is such that I just don't have the wherewithal, the financial worthiness, if you will, because with my legislative salary and everything I'm just living paycheck to paycheck. So anyway, that's where I'm at and again, I'm not trying to come to the well, I'm only here just to ask if you guys would consider helping me and suggest some options to me as to what could be done. Anyway, just, that's what I had for you.

Allen: Let's say you got a new loan. Uh, you know, you got to be real careful, Vic on ... Say, like, I co-signed with you, you'd have to be ...

Kohring: Very discreet about it?

Allen: Oh, yeah, or it'd be, have to be ...

Kohring: I know there's the political issue of ...

Allen: APOC ...

Kohring: APOC, and the criticism that all of us, now because of our relationships and all that ...

Allen: But too, though, you know I don't want your, a record out there for you. So how quick, how much time have you got?

Kohring: It's not clear to me yet; I'm working with the collection agency. My guess is they're going to demand full payment probably within 60 days or so.

Smith: Within 60?

Kohring: That would be my guess. I had a similar experience with another ... I had several credit cards that I maxed out on in order to take care of my medical bills and one of which demanded full payment and they gave me 60 days and I paid full ...

Allen: Don't you have insurance with the state?

Kohring: I do. But with Mayo Clinic, they didn't cover all the expenses, I ended up eating a lot of the costs. It's not on the insurance company's preferred provided list so I ended up eating a lot of the costs associated with that surgery. It was at Mayo Clinic and Aetna only covers hospitals in the western part of the country, not back east.

Smith: Give Bill and me a little time to chew on it, figure it out.

Allen: Let me figure a way ...

Kohring: I want to do everything completely aboveboard, of course, I don't want anybody to get in any kind of hot water or get criticized by anybody.

Smith: Absolutely.

Kohring: And again, please don't feel like I'm abusing my relationship with you guys, OK?

Allen: Oh no, no no. That's ... I'm doing this if I can get it done because you're my friend.

Kohring: Thank you.

Allen: Not ...

Kohring: Thank you very much. That's why I came to you two, because the feeling is definitely mutual.

Allen: Let me see what I can do ... maybe, maybe, I could ... not my bank ... uh ... s---, can't say it.

Kohring: Wells Fargo?

Allen: Yeah, or something like that.

Kohring: OK. All right. Thank you, thank you for your consideration.

Allen: Let me kinda, let me see if maybe somebody could ...

Kohring: Thank you. I appreciate that.

Allen: So, if you got a loan, how much can you pay, you know, as it goes along?

Kohring: Yeah. Well I could probably uh, afford ... uh,

Allen: Five thousand ... I mean, five dollars, uh ...?

Kohring: Five hundred dollars a month? That would be a real stretch. I was going to suggest $400 a month. Five hundred would be a real stretch. But I could probably make 500 do. I could scrape together the money and make 500 do. So if you were to factor in an interest rate, that would probably amortize out over, golly, probably a couple years or so, if you're talking 17 grand. Shoot, that's 34 months without interest, so that would be almost three years, if not more.

Allen: And you owe, it's about 17?

Kohring: About $17,000, yeah.

Smith: Does that include all the penalties and interest?

Kohring: Yes it does, yes. I'm going to still try to sell that doggone house of mine in Wasilla. I had it listed for 110, and I just couldn't get it sold. I think it was more of a problem with the lack of aggressiveness on the part of the broker, but it contributed to the financial woes not having the rent that I was getting from that of $900 a month, cause I took it off the rental market. I just recently re-rented it now, I'm getting $850 right now for it, so I'm getting that income stream coming in. But if I could sell the doggone thing, I could extract 40 grand equity out of it, and use that to pay off the ...

Allen: You still owe ... you owe ... money on ...

Kohring: I owe money on the house. I have a loan on it. Yes. It's worth about 110, and I owe about, let's see, about 75, I believe it is. I've got about $45,000 equity in it.

Smith: Valued at 110?

Kohring: It's about 110, yes. Just a small ranch house in Wasilla that I used to live in until Tony Knowles and his gang reapportioned me out of it back in 2000, if you remember that fiasco.

Allen: Yeah, yeah.

Kohring: A lot of us were targeted by the Knowles administration. I built that house for my wife, and lived in there for awhile and then I got reapportioned out of it so it became rental, that was when my financial issues came up a few years ago after my surgery, tried to sell it, and after fixing it up for a couple years and just haven't been able to do so. Love to be able to just go out and get a loan and take care of this, but my credit is such and my ratios are such that I just wouldn't qualify. I'm just trying to pull myself back from the brink at this point, and as far as a potential political, it wouldn't be a disaster for me, because I think I can get elected -- short of going out shooting somebody -- 'cause I'm strong politically, but I don't want to have any blemishes on my record and this could potentially be one for me.

Allen: Let me see what I can do with it.

Kohring: Yeah. Good. All right. Thank you for the thought.

Allen: You know, I'd just give you the ... I'd just ... I mean, I'd borrow that ... but I can't do it ...

Kohring: I know, because the APOC ethic rules and all that. And I would make sure that everything was done in accordance to law too; I would research that as well and I could present a hypothetical scenario to, say, the ethics committee and they'd give me a private, confidential response. But again it would be completely hypothetical without any names mentioned or anything so nobody would know who I'm associating with. But I would do that just to make sure everything is done in accordance with law so nobody gets embarrassed later down the road.

Allen: Who you going to do? You're going to talk to who?

Kohring: Well, Joyce Anderson is the ethics committee adviser to the Legislature, and we work with her on a confidential basis where we can ask her hypothetical questions about situations, she can give us answers, just to give us guidance as to how best to conduct our financial affairs. If I ever borrow money from somebody or if I ever have any kind of financial transaction, I seek advice from her as many legislators do to make sure that we're not violating any law. So that's how it ...

Allen: If you tell her what you're going to do, or you need to, I don't know if that's real smart.

Kohring: Yeah, that's a good point. It might be better for me just simply to research the statute and just come to a conclusion myself on it.

Allen: That's the best way. And then nobody knows. ...

Kohring: Yeah, no red flags are raised, right? That's a good point. I thought of that too, and really, uh, to my knowledge the way the law works right now, say if I were to borrow money from somebody, if it's in excess of $5,000 I have to disclose it on an annual financial disclosure. So that's where it would come into play. If I borrowed it from you personally, or from Veco or some financial entity or a bank, I'd have to actually ... write everything down.

Allen: We wouldn't do that with Veco. It would have to be with me. ...

Kohring: And again, I'm not here to ask you for work, but say if we went down that road and you were able to pay me for a service that you thought I could provide you, again, don't feel any pressure but I'm just throwing that out as an example. ...

Allen: It would be too ... anything that would have Veco on it, oh s---.

Kohring: Yeah, well I'm very proud of myself. ...

Allen: But, you know, you could go work for us in the summer or something like that.

Kohring: I would want to make sure, Bill, that if you did have me do something for you that it was something you truly could benefit from. I don't want any freebie.

Allen: Well you got to ... you'd have to go to work

Kohring: I'd have to bust my butt.

Allen: ... go up to the Slope, or some goddamn thing, because you gotta ... it's gotta ...

Kohring: I want it to be above board, I don't want anybody to ever criticize our relationship and imply that somehow you're giving me some big benefit that I don't deserve.

Allen: Because it will go right to the f---ing Daily News.

Kohring: Of course, yeah. I'm not trying to pressure you. ...

Allen: Don't say anything until I can figure out where it won't come back and bite me and bite your ass and my ass.

Kohring: Yes, really. And I won't present any kind of hypothetical scenario to anybody, I'll keep it to my ...

Allen: I wouldn't say to anybody that you're in a bind.

Kohring: Well, no, I wouldn't tell anybody that I'm in a financial situation; I would just, uh, what I was thinking of doing was just simply to say, what if I borrow a loan from somebody, how is that supposed to be handled in the eyes of the law? That's all I'd present it as, but I don't even have to do that.

Allen: What do you think, Rick?

Kohring: I don't want to raise any red flags either.

Smith: Well. I wouldn't ...

Kohring: But I know the law good enough ...

Smith: Well, let's think about a way to do it ...

Kohring: OK.

Smith: ... before you do anything.

Kohring: Yeah, good.

Allen: When are you taking off for ...

Kohring: For Easter?

Allen: Yeah.

Kohring: I think Easter is about the 16th, if I remember right.

Smith: The 15th. The 13th is Thursday. The 16th.

Kohring: OK. So I'll be leaving the evening of the 13th, coming back the morning of the 17th, I believe it is. I'll be gone for four days.

Smith: Eighteenth. You guys are shut down Friday to Monday.

Kohring: I'm leaving Thursday and coming back on a Monday, so I'll be gone for four days, whatever the dates are that that represents. First time I will have been with my daughter on an Easter, after all these years. Can you believe that? Because Easter always falls during a session, and I always find myself swamped being near the end of the session. I've never had a chance to be there for Easter for her. Can you believe that?

Allen: OK, here's what I want you to do. (He leans forward toward Kohring.) With, uh, what I usually do on Christmas, I mean, and ...

Kohring: For holidays?

Allen: ... and Easters ... I always take a, when I got kids (Kohring chuckles). And always, I really, I go hide ...

Smith: Eggs.

Allen: ... an egg with ...

Kohring: Yes.

Allen: With ...

Kohring: With money in it?

Allen: Money or ...

Kohring: Or candy. Oh yeah. Nuka said, 'Daddy Daddy, can we do an Easter egg hunt?'

Allen (to Smith): Have you got any ... have you got any?

Smith: I got some.

Allen: Did you get any hundreds?

Smith: Yep. (Smith stands and takes what appears to be money out of his pocket.)

Kohring: Well, thank you very much.

Allen: I'll give you ...

Kohring: That's very kind of you; I appreciate that.

Allen (to Smith): Give me a hundred. (Smith hands Allen money.) And that way you can ...

Kohring: Put those in the Easter eggs. All right. (Allen hands cash to Kohring on the screen.) I shall do that, thank you very much. (Kohring and Allen shake hands.) Thank you so much.

Allen: And let her find the egg.

Kohring: I will. We're going to have an Easter egg hunt right at the house, and I'll put money in, I promise (Allen chuckles.) ... and she'll be thrilled. I just sent her some money for her mom to buy her a Girl Scout uniform, she's thrilled about that, and I sent her a card telling her about how much I love and miss her and 20 bucks was included in that and ...

Allen: All right, well then, let me help you on that little ... (Allen pulls more bills and hands them to Kohring. He later testified it was several hundred dollars.)

Kohring: Oh, thank you, thank you.

Allen: ... on her little uniform.

Kohring: On the uniform. The 50 I sent was a little short, so thank you. Said she needs about 100. I appreciate that, Bill, thank you so much. (Kohring and Allen shake hands.) Well, just in closing I know you guys got things to do. ...

Smith: ... See what Conoco is sort of up to here ...

Kohring: What can I do at this point to help you guys, anything? Whatever you ... you know ... just keep lobbying my colleagues for the governor's plan, right?

Allen: Are you real close with ol', any of these guys ...

Smith: Stoltze (Rep. Bill Stoltze, R-Wasilla).

Kohring: Oh, yes. Stoltze, moderately so. ...

Allen: Yeah, Stoltze. Stoltze. Can you help?

Kohring: I can. I can go to him. I'm not real close to Bill. I've got a very close relationship with Chenault (Rep. Mike Chenault, R-Kenai) and Meyer (Rep. Kevin Meyer, R-Anchorage), Meyer in particular, a good friend. Stoltze ...

Allen: I think they're on the right side.

Kohring: OK. Stoltze could go either way, then?

Allen: Well, ah ... you know, who's all on the Finance?

Kohring: House Finance?

Allen: Holm (Rep. Jim Holm, R-Fairbanks). You know Holm?

Kohring: I know Holm well. I think he's unpredictable; he's kind of like Stoltze, hard to figure out where he's coming from. I think Kelly (Rep. Mike Kelly, R-Fairbanks) is probably with us. ...

Allen: Kelly?

Kohring: I've got a good rapport with him.

Allen: Do you?

Kohring: And I've got a great relationship with Richard Foster (Rep. Richard Foster, D-Nome); who doesn't? Everybody likes Richard. And then Moses, Carl Moses (Rep. Carl Moses, D-Unalaska), he and I get along well. He's a very quiet person, doesn't say much, keeps things close to his chest. But I'm comfortable in going and talking to him.

Allen: Kinda ... kinda ... figure out ... kinda see what they're really thinking about. Kinda tell us where they're really at.

Kohring: OK. OK. Just get an honest, straightforward opinion from them, right?

Allen: Yeah, and then you can tell us where they're at and then maybe you can push 'em over on your column.

Kohring: Yes. Well, I'll make every effort to do that. My first effort will be to figure out where they're at, and then secondly I'll politely and gently and carefully as I can influence them in a positive way to see that the governor's bill is the vehicle they consider. I know that's very important to you. I know that's key to the gas line, and I know that's why you're here. I want nothing better than the governor's bill to pass and that gas line to come to fruition. Even though I'm ...

Allen: Or if you think of anybody else that we could get.

Kohring: OK, all right. You know my position is an anti-tax position and I'd just as soon the industry not be taxed any, we give credits, but I understand that this is an integral part of the whole deal here. OK, well, how about if I over the next couple days I will make an effort at talking to these people individually and then I will give you guys a report to let you know how that goes.

Allen: Kind of tell us who's really over there.

Kohring: Sure, I can do that, absolutely.

Allen: You know, the one on the oil ... the governor's ... the 20/20.

Kohring: Yes. Who is really with the governor's plan. You bet. OK. Just lastly, Tatiana (Kohring's wife, who is from Russia and lives in Oregon), I told her about the fact that you received that gift real well, you were very pleased with that, she was real excited to hear that. It was her idea, by the way. Do you like vodka?

Allen: Yeah, yeah, hell, yeah, we already drank some of it.

Kohring: We drink a lot of that in our house, believe me. I never had any vodka in my life until I met her, and now we drink a lot of it. Not excessively, but it's part of a social thing at dinner and so forth.

Smith: Sure. Yeah.

Kohring: I've discovered that it helps to escape a little bit from your woes of the world when you get buzzed. I had a tough day today; oh, man. I had a difficult constituent who's got some mental issues who threatened me today, back home in Wasilla of all things, oh brother. And then I was on a radio program, I was on a nationwide live radio program with this station owned by the NRA, the rifle association based in Washington, D.C.; they had me on their program about an hour ago.

Allen: Yeah.

Kohring: It was live, it was great. They were throwing me softballs because they like me, 'cause of my pro-gun positions, but they had picked up on the Internet that article that came out in the Frontiersman two days ago about me being an advocate of the Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms. So they asked me if I'd be on their show and I said absolutely. It was great.

Smith: Good, good. Yeah.

Kohring: So I've got nationwide exposure now; with that nationwide exposure I ought to run for president, take advantage of it. (Everyone laughs). All right, guys. (Kohring stands and extends his hand to Allen and they shake). Thank you so very much for your time and all your help; I'm very grateful for it.

Smith (pointing at jars of food on the table): And grab some of those babies. Take a pocketful.

Kohring: Oh sure, I will. I'll take a couple here, thank you. Delicious.

Allen (pushing the jar toward Kohring): Come on.

Kohring (reaching into jar and taking more of the treats): OK, I won't be shy here, for crying out loud; I'll take more of them.

Allen: There you go, there you go.

Kohring: Thank you again very much. Appreciate it. I'll be keeping in touch.

The next day, on March 31, Kohring left a message with Smith and also called him to report setting up the meetings he'd talked about, according to the FBI wiretaps played for the jury.